Torque converter shudder
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Thread: Torque converter shudder

  1. #1
    Junior Member Vanpounds1's Avatar
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    Torque converter shudder

    Does anyone else experienced a shudder when the C7 shifts from overdrive to passing gear? It is a very hard shudder that makes such a hesitation or shudder that the passenger can feel it. It does not shudder every time but about 80 percent of the time. We went to the Tail of the Dragon this past weekend and it shudders every time while ongoing threw the mountains under all driving conditions. It also does not matter what position my driving dial is positioned in. Any one else with this bug?

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    Senior Member mjw930's Avatar
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    We are going to need more info to possible help here. A6 or A8, full auto mode only or also when you shift manually?
    Mark

    2015 Porsche Boxster GTS
    2014 2LT Z51 7sp Coupe (sold)
    2019 Ram 1500 (tow vehicle)
    2015 Porsche Macan S (wife's daily driver)

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    Banned Tuner Boost's Avatar
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    Haven't heard of this issue yet, but what you describe sure could be TC....

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    Senior Member mjw930's Avatar
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    I'm thinking it's more along the lines of the V4 to V8 transition but there is a TSB on the A8 for something similar, we just need more info from the OP.
    Mark

    2015 Porsche Boxster GTS
    2014 2LT Z51 7sp Coupe (sold)
    2019 Ram 1500 (tow vehicle)
    2015 Porsche Macan S (wife's daily driver)

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    Banned Tuner Boost's Avatar
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    Good point. Could very well be, and that could be corrected in the tune.

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    Senior Member regguy1's Avatar
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    I don't believe it will be a TCC (torque converter clutch) shudder. On kickdown the TCC will release if it was applied. TCC shudders typically occur on application, not release.
    1LT Coupe / Crystal Red / Black Int. / 7MT / Navigation / Performance Exhaust (Ordered 03/20/2014)

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    Junior Member Vanpounds1's Avatar
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    UPDATE...GM sent a program to the dealership here called Maxie Price Chevrolet in Loganville, GA. The mechanic drove it with a laptop hooked up. It showed the problem as the Torque Converter and a module malfunction. So, I am at a dilemma here. We do not want a NEW C7 that has been taken half apart and spread out on a dealership floor. This may sound bad, but my $73 K was spent on a new car. This car has had this problem since we drove it off the lot. We will see how GM treats us. I have owned many Corvettes and will continue to have a few around so I am really counting on some good common sense treatment. I will keep everyone posted.

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    Supporting Vendor ChevroletCustomerCare's Avatar
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    Hi Vanpounds,

    We're sorry to hear that you're experiencing a concern with your 'vette! Please keep us updated on how your visit goes, and let us know if there are any questions we can look into.

    Marissa
    Chevrolet Customer Care
    Vanpounds1 and V Vette like this.

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    Banned Tuner Boost's Avatar
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    I would not be the least bit concerned about the repair. They wont do anything to diminish value with the repair, in fact just the opposite. As issues pop up and become known that did not, or could not in the testing phase, the fix is generally superior to how the car came from the factory, and it becomes a non-issue in the future if the fix is correct. These are not $250,000 to $1 mil and up hand built supercars, (even though they perform in all areas as well or better than many) these are still a production car with a bargain price tag. Let the dealer do the fix, and report back on the results. If it is successful you will have a car better than another one that may have this issue and need it addressed as well. You will also provide other owners here with valuable info on an issue I have not been aware of until yours, but may rear it's head for others. If you give them ample opportunity to correct an issue and they fail, and or treat you badly, then that would be grounds to demand more for sure.

    Good luck and let us all know how it turns out! Cheers!

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    Senior Member booie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChevroletCustomerCare View Post
    Hi Vanpounds,

    We're sorry to hear that you're experiencing a concern with your 'vette! Please keep us updated on how your visit goes, and let us know if there are any questions we can look into.

    Marissa
    Chevrolet Customer Care
    I must say it is very comforting to see Chevy Customer Care is watching this site for issues and is doing everything proactively possible to keep us Vette owners happy. Keep up the good work.

    bppie

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    Junior Member Vanpounds1's Avatar
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    I am back to keep everyone informed on the Transmission shudder. We have had an experience with GM and Maxie Price Chevrolet in Loganville, GA. that we could only wish for. The service technician and GM came to the conclusion that the Torque converter and a transmission module needed to be replaced. The next day they decided that it was best to change the transmission and not just the converter. At this point Raleigh and I did not want the car anymore. We negotiated some trade assistance from GM to help us get a new Corvette. First I would like to say that Scott Price at Maxie Price Chevrolet bent over backwards to get us into a new car. Maxie Price had a 2014 Article White 3LT Z51 convertible with Adrenaline red interior and magnetic suspension ride control sitting on the showroom floor. Scott Price help us get into this at an unbelievable price. The car is SWEET...we love it...If you want a new Corvette or any other new vehicle, we will highly recommend Maxie Price Chevrolet.Name:  image.jpg
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    Last edited by Vanpounds1; 11-28-2014 at 06:44 PM.
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    Banned Tuner Boost's Avatar
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    Now this is where people need to shop for their cars!!! The truly good dealers need our business, and they actually have techs that understand!! Good to here.
    Vanpounds1 and whchoc1 like this.

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    Glad to read that you are pleased with your new Z51 Vert and how well the dealer and GM treated you.
    Vanpounds1 likes this.
    aka Jeff
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    Junior Member angelia's Avatar
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    I know your last post is over 2 years old but I would like to know if you had any problems with the new 2014 you purchased to replace the one with the shudder issues? I bought a new 2016 Stingray that started having the shudder. The torque converter was replaced 3 weeks ago and now it is doing the same thing again. There is some other procedure the service department is going to do next week that is supposed to fix the issue but we will see what happens. I feel the same way you do about having a new car that has been torn apart for repair twice now. If you don't mind me asking, how did GM help you negotiate on a new one? I loved the car initially but now it is frustrating to drive with the constant shudder.

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    Post 2015 - 2017 Corvette: Shake and/or Shudder During Light Throttle Between 25 and 80 mp

    With thanks and credit to the Corvette Action Center, and elegant for locating this:

    2015 - 2017 Corvette: Service Bulletin: Shake and/or Shudder During Light Throttle Acceleration Between 25 and 80 MPH (40 and 128 KM/H) at a Steady State
    Last Updated: Thu, Mar 2, 2017 at 1:45 PM

    Some customers may comment on any of the following conditions:

    A shake and/or shudder during light throttle acceleration between 25 and 80 mph (40 and 128 km/h) steady state driving when transmission is not actively shifting gears.
    A shudder feeling that may be described as driving over rumble strips or rough pavement.
    For 2015-2016 vehicles, shudder feeling is evident in both Drive and M7 mode.
    For 2017 vehicles, shudder feeling is evident in both Drive and L7 mode.
    Diagnosis Instructions
    To ensure TCC shudder is diagnosed correctly, please drive the following schedule on a smooth road with transmission sump temperature between 122°F (50°C) - 158°F (70°C ).

    Important: For some road conditions, it may be required to apply the brake pedal and throttle simultaneously to stay within desired engine torque range, and engine/vehicle speed ranges.

    Run the following tests for 3 operational modes:

    A. Normal Operation (GDS2 for viewing only).

    B. GDS2 Commanding TCC in Disabled Operation. (TCC Open).

    C. GDS2 Commanding TCC in Enabled Operation. (TCC Locked).

    To confirm TCC shudder, the vibration concern must be created in normal operation (Mode A) of the test. If the concern is gone with the torque converter clutch disabled (Mode B, TCC Open) and is gone when the torque converter clutch enabled (Mode C, TCC Locked), the vibration root cause is TCC shudder and the fluid flush procedure corrective action described below should be performed.

    If the concern is not present in Mode A, then the vibration concern is not TCC shudder. If the concern is still present with the torque converter clutch disabled (Mode B) or with the torque converter clutch enabled (Mode C, TCC slip speed at zero), the root cause of vibration is NOT shudder. Vibrations not identified as shudder should be further investigated using the “Vehicle Vibration Diagnosis in SI as a starting point.

    The use of the PICO scope and NVH software can be used to confirm TCC shudder, Engine, Tire or Driveline component related conditions.

    To confirm TCC shudder record the PICO scope data while driving in 8th gear in the application specific condition above. Minimize extraneous vibration input by testing on a smooth road and correct any other known vehicle vibration issues (tires, brakes, etc.) before conducting test. If TCC Shudder is present, a vibration peak will appear (highlighted by arrow below) within +/-2 Hz of the frequency listed in the table above. TCC Shudder vibration frequency should remain constant in 8th gear as indicated in the above table. If the vibration frequency follows vehicle speed or engine speed, then it is NOT TCC Shudder.


    Service Procedure
    Important: Requires Mobil 1 Synthetic LV ATF DEXRON HP (GM Part No. 19353429, in Canada 19353430).

    Note: U.S. dealers must order the Mobil 1 Synthetic LV ATF DEXRON HP fluid through your local General Motors oil distributor. Canadian dealer must order through CCA.

    Step 1: Cooler Flush, Drain, Clean pan/magnet, Replace Filter (If needed), Oil Fill, & Circulate New Fluid

    Note: The Transmission Fluid Cooler Flow Test and Flushing procedure can be located by building the vehicle in SI, select Transmission, Transmission Cooling, Diagnostic Information and Procedures. Select the appropriate transmission.

    1 a.) Flush the cooler lines and cooler, refer to SI for proper procedure.

    Note: DEXRON VI transmission fluid may be used to flow and flush the transmission cooling system. Compressed air should be used to remove any residual fluid from transmission cooler lines.

    1 b.) Remove the transmission fluid pan and drain transmission fluid following SI procedures for the application you’re working on. Discard all oil.

    Note: If you find that the fluid is cloudy, milky, or appears to be contaminated with water or engine coolant, DO NOT proceed with below steps. Follow Both SI Procedures for “Cooling System Leak Testing (L83, L86)” and “Engine Coolant/Water in Transmission.”

    1 c.) Clean the pan/magnet if any metallic particles present and replace transmission filter if debris is found.

    1 d.) Install the transmission fluid pan and refill with new transmission fluid using enough volume to have oil come out of oil level check plug.

    Important: Operate the vehicle on the hoist for 10 minutes. Cycle through all forward gear ranges, Reverse and Neutral.



    Step 2: Drain, Oil Fill, & Circulate New Fluid

    2 a.) Remove the transmission fluid pan and drain transmission fluid again. Discard all oil.

    2 b.) Install the transmission fluid pan and refill with new transmission fluid using enough volume to have oil come out of oil level check plug.

    Important: Operate the vehicle on the hoist for 10 minutes. Cycle through all forward gear ranges, Reverse and Neutral.



    Step 3: Drain, Oil level Set, and Drive to Evaluate

    3 a.) Remove the transmission fluid pan and drain transmission fluid again. Discard all oil.

    3 b.) Install the transmission fluid pan and refill with new transmission fluid following the “Fluid Fill Procedure” in SI to obtain correct fluid level.

    The shudder should be improved after the completion of this triple flush procedure.

    Note: Shudder should improve directionally right away, but for full affect the vehicle may need to be driven up to 200 miles (322 km). and at least two cold to hot drive cycles before determining if the fluid flush corrected the condition or not. Do not re-evaluate vehicle for additional customer shudder concerns until the vehicle has been driven 200 miles (322 km).

    Warranty Information
    For vehicles repaired under the Bumper-to-Bumper coverage (Canada Base Warranty coverage), use the following labor operation. Reference the Applicable Warranties section of Investigate Vehicle History (IVH) for coverage information.

    LABOR OPERATION

    DESCRIPTION

    LABOR TIME

    8480478*

    Flush and Drain Fluids for Transmission Shake and/or Shutter Repair

    Use Actual Clock Time

    *This is a unique Labor Operation for Bulletin use only.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    For a complete listing of TSBs please see https://www.stingrayforums.com/forum/...tml#post184236
    Last edited by jsvette; 03-03-2017 at 09:35 AM.
    aka Jeff
    'RedHot' Prod.Wk 7 Oct '13 Museum Del. 29 Oct '13
    Torch Red, 2LT Adrenaline Red, AutoTrans., Nav., Perf. Exhaust, Transparent panel, Red Brembos, CQuartz Finest
    Contributing Member of the National Corvette Museum

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